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drewmayes
Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 11 2011, 12:54 PM EDT | Post edited: Aug 11 2011, 12:54 PM EDT
What evidence is their to support Alison Weir's statement in "Lady in the Tower" that Jane Rochford admited on the scaffold before her death, "I falsely accused him of loving, in an incestuour manner, his sister, Queen Anne Boleyn." Do you find this valuable?    
MsSquirrly
MsSquirrly
1. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 11 2011, 1:29 PM EDT | Post edited: Aug 11 2011, 1:29 PM EDT
"What evidence is their to support Alison Weir's statement in "Lady in the Tower" that Jane Rochford admited on the scaffold before her death, "I falsely accused him of loving, in an incestuour manner, his sister, Queen Anne Boleyn." "
Weir cites a source after that sentence. It merely says "Original Letters". I cannot find the full citation as to whose letters exactly. To be honest, this is the problem with "The Lady in the Tower", she quotes every single reference she can find for a certain event, even if it has been discounted as incorrect, or speculation, or gossip or hearsay. Some of her quotes are well known biased Victorian secondary sources. Good historians evaluate primary source evidence and read it critically and don't just quote willy nilly.
4  out of 5 found this valuable. Do you?    
Elliemental
Elliemental
2. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 11 2011, 1:59 PM EDT | Post edited: Aug 11 2011, 2:00 PM EDT
If Jane Parker really did say this, then surely it would have been commented upon by the leading Chroniclers, Ambassadors, etc of the time? (making a reliable source easy to find). However, I have found little information about Jane's speech, other than that it was rather lengthy, and bravely delivered (considering that she'd recently suffered some sort of breakdown). Do you find this valuable?    
henry's7thwife
henry's7thwife
3. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 11 2011, 9:59 PM EDT | Post edited: Aug 11 2011, 10:03 PM EDT
Alison Weir writes any crap she finds, without checking whether they are true or not. She only admitted her own guilt and followed the usual "God bless the King" tradition. Nary a word about the Boleyns.

Quoting from a Chapuys letter: "Then Lady Rochford was brought, who had shown symptoms of madness till they told her she must die. Neither she nor the Queen spoke much on the scaffold; they only confessed their guilt and prayed for the King's welfare."

Quoting from Marillac's letter: "The Queen was so weak that she could hardly speak, but confessed in few words that she had merited a hundred deaths for so offending the King who had so graciously treated her. The lady of Rochefort said as much in a long discourse of several faults which she had committed in her life."

If there had been ANY reference to the Boleyns, the entire matter would not be finished within two lines. They were a major scandal and would require lines of explanation from the Spanish and French Ambassadors to their respective sovereigns. And seriously, no one would be concerned about dead husbands when one is about to die herself!

Alison Weir is a fraud and a cheat, calling herself a historian.
1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
royalfalcon
royalfalcon
4. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 12 2011, 12:35 AM EDT | Post edited: Aug 12 2011, 12:35 AM EDT
In Julia Fox's book Jane Boleyn, The Infamous Lady Rochford, she quotes one Ottwelll Johnson a cloth dealer and victualler who gave the only known eyewitness account at the execution as saying that Lady Rochford just made a speech praising the King, not once to she refer to any specific offences. It was by all accounts a standard type of pre execution speech. I am sure if she had made any reference to the Boleyns it would most certainly have been noted. 2  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    
freya9
freya9
5. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 13 2011, 9:17 AM EDT | Post edited: Aug 13 2011, 9:17 AM EDT
Besides isn't there some doubt about whether it was Lady Rochford who made the allegation of incest ? Do you find this valuable?    
LadyTudorsFan
LadyTudorsFan
6. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 14 2011, 6:43 AM EDT | Post edited: Aug 14 2011, 6:43 AM EDT
It's possible that the allegation of incest may have come from Lady Worcester, rather than Lady Rochford. Lady Rochford never mentioned George Boleyn in her final speech on the scaffold. She had a nervous breakdown, but Henry sent his own Doctor to make sure she recovered on time for her execution so that he could make an example of her. Lady Rochford was asked to write down what Anne and George had said when they accused Henry of being impotent. This was shown to George in the trial and he was asked nicely not to repeat the letter's contents. However, he upset the court and did. This may have helped to jeopardize the verdict of the panel because how a person came across to the court was important in those days - by upsetting the panel, they were probably prepared to believe the worst of him, even if he was really innocent. So, unfortunately, their final verdict was Guilty. Do you find this valuable?    
royalfalcon
royalfalcon
7. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 14 2011, 6:51 AM EDT | Post edited: Aug 14 2011, 6:51 AM EDT
I suspect that George Boleyn knew he would be found guilty anyway and so deided to read the message out loud thinking he had nothing to lose. Do you find this valuable?    
LadyTudorsFan
LadyTudorsFan
8. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 14 2011, 7:16 AM EDT | Post edited: Aug 14 2011, 7:16 AM EDT
"I suspect that George Boleyn knew he would be found guilty anyway and so deided to read the message out loud thinking he had nothing to lose."
Yeah true.I guess that showed in itself the absurdity of the whole thing - being accused of sleeping with his own sister along with four other men without solid evidence to prove it. Anne couldn't even blow her nose without people noticing let alone have multiple affairs behind Henry's back.
Do you find this valuable?    
henry's7thwife
henry's7thwife
9. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 14 2011, 8:41 AM EDT | Post edited: Aug 14 2011, 8:41 AM EDT
"I suspect that George Boleyn knew he would be found guilty anyway and so deided to read the message out loud thinking he had nothing to lose."
Yes, but was he not aware that what he said or did would reflect on his family, namely his father and mother? That was how things worked in those days and Boleyn would be well aware of that fact. Or perhaps he just wanted to make a last grand stand.
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henry's7thwife
henry's7thwife
10. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 14 2011, 8:44 AM EDT | Post edited: Aug 14 2011, 8:44 AM EDT
"Yeah true.I guess that showed in itself the absurdity of the whole thing - being accused of sleeping with his own sister along with four other men without solid evidence to prove it. Anne couldn't even blow her nose without people noticing let alone have multiple affairs behind Henry's back."
Katherine Howard managed it quite well for a while. But 5 men is a bit too much, I think. I would have believed Anne's guilt if it was one man. Perhaps she really was guilty with one of them. Who knows? But certainly is not likely she slept with all!
Do you find this valuable?    
freya9
freya9
11. RE: Lady Jane Rochford question
Aug 14 2011, 8:49 AM EDT | Post edited: Aug 14 2011, 8:49 AM EDT
Katherine had an accomplice. It is one of the strange facts about Anne's fall that not one of her ladies was convicted even though without their help it would have been impossible for her to commit adultrey. 2  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    

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